Talk for Article "Money for nothing? Tracking global basic income initiatives"

Talk about this Article

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      Thanks a lot for your comment – I’ve just submitted an edit with your addition. Very constructive and useful.

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    On the Utrecht trial… the Atlantic article is from 2016 (so before the “Weten Wat Werkt” trial had started), and it looks like the details changed fundamentally: https://www.utrecht.nl/city-of-utrecht/study-on-rules-in-social-assistance/ and https://www.uu.nl/en/news/what-works-researchers-from-utrecht-university-to-conduct-study-into-better-welfare-benefits seem quite different and make no mention of a UBI-like aspect to it, nor of the amounts (or equivalent benefits) people might receive – do you agree? If so, should it be removed from the article?

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    I just added a small section about Germany into the text. While it’s a small scale project and also isn’t all that new, the NPO has been in the news again lately as the German government and policy makers try to find an alternative to the unemployment program called “Hartz IV”, which most parties agree was a failure. Discussions on basic income are certainly taking place.

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        Thanks Tsutomu, a good addition. If you know of any more initiatives please let me know in here or add it in yourself. It’s becoming a pretty good guide to basic income projects around the world.

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          Hi Lydia,
          Yeah, I will add a section on Japan as well. I know there’s been a lot of discussions taking place over there as well, but I will have to do some research first as to what initiatives have been established concretely. Just give me a few days and I’ll suggest an addition.

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            Sounds good, thank you.

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              I’ve just added a small section on Japan.

              Here are some links to the background information:

              [Wikipedia]

              General information about the general election in 2017
              https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Japanese_general_election,_2017

              [Forbes]

              “Redistribution Policy: Basic income [Table in the middle of the article]

              However, other parties do not fare better than the LDP. The POH has some interesting ideas such as basic income, but its overall economic ideas are inconsistent and unclear.”
              https://www.forbes.com/sites/mwakatabe/2017/10/17/japans-upcoming-election-will-be-won-or-lost-on-abenomics/#2c65ac3454f8

              [Asahi Shinbun]

              “She also said that the Yurinomics package of economic measures would incorporate ordinary people’s feelings into macroeconomic policy. For example, she said, her party would implement a basic income program that would increase disposable income for those in lower income brackets.”
              http://www.asahi.com/ajw/articles/AJ201710060032.html

              [Japan Times]

              “Although not a specific election promise, the party said in its manifesto that it will consider a system of basic income to secure a standard of living for all, even as advances in technology render some industries obsolete. The idea has been trialed in Finland.”
              https://www.japantimes.co.jp/news/2017/10/06/national/politics-diplomacy/tokyo-gov-koikes-upstart-party-kibo-no-vows-halt-tax-hike-debate-war-renouncing-article-9/

              Final Comment: Since the party Kibō no Tō merged with another party this month (May 7, 2018) and does not exist anymore in its prior form, I’ve referenced the party as “the then Kibō no Tō”. (The party with the same name is founded by a minority of PM from the previous party, but is strictly speaking registered as a new party from May 8, 2018)

              [Wikipedia]

              Kibo no To
              https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kib%C5%8D_no_T%C5%8D

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                Thanks so much Tsutomu, these changes are great. I will add in some of the source links to the story so people can see them when they read.

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    Thank you for this article.

    I would be interested to read about pros/cons of a UBI and impacts on the economy at a state/country level. But that may not be the goal of this article.

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      Hi Fabrice, the initial goal of this article is to outline the various experiments/UBI trials going on but we could definitely develop it into an analysis of those experiments. Please do feel free to edit the story if you are interested.

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        I’ve been thinking: perhaps we could do a break-out article that looks at how these UBI projects are affecting local economies. Would this be something you’re interested in working with me on?

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    I am fairly convinced that UBI presents no significant economic or technical problems for humans. The problems are ideological and cultural. Extreme wealth and property and person are totally protected under our cultural institution known as the Rule of Law. These rules mean millions of people can live in peace together without violence and chaos, but the rules are not perfect cause they dont deal well with poor people,stupid people, disabled people and specially dont deal well with criminals. How come this is the case? What is the problem with us that wont allow us to fix these defects in the system?

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      Certainly interesting, big questions. Thanks John.

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    One of the potential problems of UBI is whether it will cause inflation when given to every member of the community. So far, trial experiments haven’t given to everyone so haven’t produced evidence of that one way or the other.

    There is something similar, though, in some Native American groups in the USA, where income from casinos or industries is given out equally to all tribe members. But I know of no studies on the impact of such payments on their communities.

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      Thank you William. I’ll have a look at this initiative.

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          Yes! The Cherokee per capita payment studies were just what I was thinking of, but couldn’t recall offhand.

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    I think that India was doing a trial run in one of it’s provinces recently. maybe still going on?

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      DU
      Deleted User

      We’ll look into that thanks Caleb, and, of course, always feel free to add into a story yourself.

      Thanks

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      Thanks Caleb. I’ve added in the India experiment. If you know of any more please write it in here or edit the story yourself.

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    Freakonomics.com had a great story on this:
    http://freakonomics.com/podcast/mincome/

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      DU
      Deleted User

      Great suggestion Eric, thanks.

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    This story makes it sound like all of these trials are new and unprecedented, particularly the note about Finland being one of the first. I’m not sure that statement is factually untrue, but I do think it’s misleading. My understanding is that basic income trials have been conducted in at least a few places as far back as the 70’s. I think I remember one was in Canada?

    I’m not able to look up the details right now, but I feel like this historical background is very relevant to the article’s goal of giving a high level understanding of how UBI is being explored. In particular, I think it’s valuable to know how similar experiments in the past were received and what’s different about those happening now.

    I’ll try to come back to this later when I have more time for it.

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      DU
      Deleted User

      Thanks Blake,

      Very interesting point and, yes, some contextual history of UBI would be particularly relevant here.

      Please do feel free to add this. We’ll delve deeper too.

      Best

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      Thanks for your comment Blake. I will certainly try to add in the historical context of UBI here and look forward to you coming back to collaborate.

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      Hey Blake. I’ve added in some of the historical context in the introduction of the story. Let me know what you think.

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